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Winter Camping Discussion => Food and Cooking => Topic started by: Moondog55 on June 05, 2018, 10:23:17 PM

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Title: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Moondog55 on June 05, 2018, 10:23:17 PM
It may never happen but I find fun in planning
After the Meet & Greet with you felllers in 2020 I want to head up to Alaska and have a good look at Denali and the Brooks Range.
Yes this is well out of the Northern Boreal but collectively this forum has a lot of good information and knowledge.
Menu planning for a long haul deep winter sled-hauling trip is difficult but I have another full year and a half to get some stuff together.
I hate freeze dried meals but weight limits will mean that these will be needed for at least half the calories needed on the trip, and I'm sure I couldn't eat Scotts ideal Antarctic ration of pemmican and ships biscuits for more than 3 days without throwing up either.
My standard tinned plum pudding is no longer made so are there any North American companies still making a tinned plum pudding or fruit cake? If so are they palatable?
OR
Would an allocation of one of the 2400calorie Mainstay bars per day be reasonable?
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Bothwell Voyageur on June 06, 2018, 09:47:44 AM
Check Amazon

You can still buy "pudding" in cans, including meat puddings, but maybe not what you are looking for. A lot of things are in plastic now for use in a microwave.

You could probably just vacuum bag and heat seal fruitcake. That would also have the advantage of being able to slice it first.

You should probably also check MRE army rations as an alternative.
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Old Guide on June 06, 2018, 10:28:52 AM
It may never happen but I find fun in planning
After the Meet & Greet with you felllers in 2020 I want to head up to Alaska and have a good look at Denali and the Brooks Range.
Yes this is well out of the Northern Boreal but collectively this forum has a lot of good information and knowledge.
Menu planning for a long haul deep winter sled-hauling trip is difficult but I have another full year and a half to get some stuff together.
I hate freeze dried meals but weight limits will mean that these will be needed for at least half the calories needed on the trip, and I'm sure I couldn't eat Scotts ideal Antarctic ration of pemmican and ships biscuits for more than 3 days without throwing up either.
My standard tinned plum pudding is no longer made so are there any North American companies still making a tinned plum pudding or fruit cake? If so are they palatable?
OR
Would an allocation of one of the 2400calorie Mainstay bars per day be reasonable?

You'll need more than 2400 calories per day if you are winter hauling and camping
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Moondog55 on June 06, 2018, 05:31:35 PM
I think you either read my post wrongly or I wasn't clear enough OG.
A half of the days ration in a 2400Calorie Mainstay bar or a fourth in a 1200 calorie bar. With modern LW gear and clothing and a 1 in 7 rest day 4800 calories per day should be sufficient
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Bothwell Voyageur on June 06, 2018, 08:36:54 PM
sufficient maybe but miserable certainly!  :)
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Old Guide on June 06, 2018, 09:15:48 PM
I think you either read my post wrongly or I wasn't clear enough OG.
A half of the days ration in a 2400Calorie Mainstay bar or a fourth in a 1200 calorie bar. With modern LW gear and clothing and a 1 in 7 rest day 4800 calories per day should be sufficient

I did read it wrong-thanks for the clarification
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: southcove on June 07, 2018, 10:28:22 AM
I am glad you are having this discussion about food and your intended travels up front.  It lets me tighten up my own schedule a bit - I am staying home, lol, the cook treats me much better than that!
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Moondog55 on June 11, 2018, 06:49:50 PM
Why miserable BV?
Would it be the boring repetition in the menu or the perceived lack of kilojoules?
4800 calories is a massive amount of food although I suspect we may lose our spare tyres doing the trip too which adds a lot to the daily count if we do.
I'd appreciate some advice from you on this matter because if I ate 4800 calories a day during my winter ski trips here I would gain weight rather than lose it.
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Old Guide on June 11, 2018, 08:45:20 PM
Why miserable BV?
Would it be the boring repetition in the menu or the perceived lack of kilojoules?
4800 calories is a massive amount of food although I suspect we may lose our spare tyres doing the trip too which adds a lot to the daily count if we do.
I'd appreciate some advice from you on this matter because if I ate 4800 calories a day during my winter ski trips here I would gain weight rather than lose it.

You'll lose weight, I'd bet on it. Football players eat 4800 calories in a diet to lose weight. After the Adirondack Ice Storm of 98 I was felling trees and doing clean up, chipping etc. I ate breakfast, break food, lunch, break food, a snack on the way home, supper and a snack. I lost 25lbs in 3 months. You'll be just as active and I was eating far more than 4800calories.
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Moondog55 on June 11, 2018, 10:16:41 PM
If that is so Old Guide then we need to add in another hundred grams of fat and an extra 100 grams of starch and sugar in the planning, that's another 1000 calories or 3 Mars /Snickers bars [ or another 1200 calorie Mainstay bar as per the posts title]
My maintenance calorie intake is about 2500 per day, the others in the party are of similar age and requirements.
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Bothwell Voyageur on June 12, 2018, 07:53:36 AM
Miserable. A combination of things. Lack of variation certainly, possibly hunger. A number of studies have shown big strong guys burning as much muscle as fat in arctic conditions when they go short of food. But also the process of switching from your normal style of food to something you would not routinely eat (though perhaps you do!) at a time when things may not be going well could leave you feeling a less than happy puppy.
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Moondog55 on June 12, 2018, 04:09:03 PM
Variety is important, this is true and it is also true that most Freeze-Dried meals are simply awful.
I leave for my skiing camp in a week or two; despite their stupidly high cost in this country I should; perhaps; buy a small batch of Mainstay bars and see how they work as part of my winter food.
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Bothwell Voyageur on June 13, 2018, 07:35:14 AM
It took me less than 30 seconds to find links to recipes to make your own bars so if you do like them and they don't set like bricks at cold temps you could save money that way.

Same for meals. Freeze dried meat and veggies and mixes for cheese, butter and eggs can be found on Amazon. We have spent the start of many overseas trips in a hotel room surrounded by bags of ingredient, measuring stuff out into Ziploc bags.
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: buddhabelly on June 13, 2018, 09:01:26 AM
just to be clear....you're talking about camping in Alaska right ? you're going to need lots of candles and books cuz there ain't going to be much light in either place since there's not going to be much time for hauling;)
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Moondog55 on June 13, 2018, 05:20:36 PM
Yes I can make my own bars easily.
The problem being time and a place to do it as I can't bring home made bars into the country from here. Only commercially packed/factory made food products are allowed through. I know people break this rule all the time but I won't take the chance. Also I need the full luggage allowance for my gear; apart from that only having 90 days on my visa and not wanting to spend a lot of my O/S time cooking and prepping foods
I just thought something like a mainstay bar would make things a lot easier and quicker
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Bothwell Voyageur on June 13, 2018, 06:39:39 PM
Good points.

So instead of Mainstay why not just look at regular energy bars? Lost to choose from and you don't really need them to last 5 years! Clif bars are huge here or we have a very local to me GORP bar which has a load of great ingredients.

Only takes a couple of hours to put meals together, who needs sleep anyway. You'll be so hyper by the time you arrive and with strange time zones you won't be able to sleep so why not use the time productively!
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Moondog55 on June 13, 2018, 08:21:56 PM
Most energy/muesli bars I have tried are nauseatingly sweet, much sweeter than my usual fruitcake. Somebody on a local forum who has tried the Mainstay bar mentioned that it was only marginally sweeter than bread. I won't be tasting one here if I can avoid it, I just found out that the local cost of a 1200calorie bar is $14- EACH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 10 times the cost of the same calories in a couple of Mars bars
You're right, much cheaper to buy some pots and baking trays when I get over and spend a couple of days making good dense fruit cake
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Old Guide on June 13, 2018, 09:34:19 PM
If that is so Old Guide then we need to add in another hundred grams of fat and an extra 100 grams of starch and sugar in the planning, that's another 1000 calories or 3 Mars /Snickers bars [ or another 1200 calorie Mainstay bar as per the posts title]
My maintenance calorie intake is about 2500 per day, the others in the party are of similar age and requirements.


Make sure those extra calories aren't just sugar. One needs nutrition.
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Moondog55 on June 13, 2018, 11:08:07 PM
Make sure those extra calories aren't just sugar. One needs nutrition.
True but also I have seen and read speculation that one of the reasons for the spectacular failure of RFScott was [ as well as an all round calorie deficit] a lack of simple sugars in the diet, which is surprising when you think about how popular Kendal Mint Cake and Barley sugar were in England at that time.

Still we have learned a lot from his mistakes as well as the success's of others
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: southcove on June 16, 2018, 04:54:10 PM
I know nothing of mint cake or Barley Sugar...huh? 

But I do know that Scott's men wrote glowingly in their journals of a secret ingredient in their 'hoosh' meal pots on the way to the pole, called Victor.   Said to be quite the ingredient. 
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: K. on June 16, 2018, 07:46:09 PM
I'd personally go with a box or twenty of the afore-mentioned clif bars, and if you're crossing paths with folks on this forum along the way maybe they can hook you up with a side-trip to Costco which is the best deal that I know of. But if sugar fraction of the calories is a concern with the energy bar category then there's also the so-called protein bar category, also available in bulk at costco, where the calories from sugar are reduced somewhat. The thing about these modern high-tech bars is some of them are qualified as meal-replacement. I first learned about this key distinction from a guy that lifted weights, simple calories weren't enough it had to be the whole mix of vitamins, minerals, riboflavin, you name it.
Title: Re: Basic food rations Tinned fruitcake or Mainstay Lifeboat bars?
Post by: Old Guide on June 16, 2018, 10:01:21 PM
Skratch has a new high protein energy bar on the market.
I have not tried it.