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Author Topic: Winter Camping on Ice  (Read 6698 times)

Offline ravinerat

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2016, 07:54:21 pm »
Ice climbing screws work great. Effortless to put in or take out. I use two for my fish trap. A little expensive but you can get used ones off climbing sites. They last a long time.

RR
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Offline Undersky

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #16 on: November 20, 2016, 11:34:18 am »
Last two winters we've been trying out different ways to completely cover the floor.

I absolutely love boughs on the floor for their effectiveness and b/c they are traditional; don't have to haul them, smell great, reduce the radiant stove heat melting the snow floor, decrease the heat-loss to melting and sublimating floor snow/ice, allow spills to "disappear", stay dry on top, etc.

But in well-used wilderness (and in not-so-wilderness areas) cutting boughs is not good practice ... especially when, if you are staying more than one night, you need a pretty thick covering under and around the stove to accomplish the qualities listed above.

We've looked at other floor coverings, and found some positive surprizes.

Melting or sublimating any floor snow/ice takes a LOT of heat, and that heat comes at our cost. If it is not too cold outside, then our stove can pump out enough heat to handle keeping us comfortable, drying wet gear, cooking supper, and melting the floor snow. But we still had to cut the extra wood needed to make the heat required to burn to melt that snow!

I used to say, "Ya, but the heat is being produced anyway, it's not like we have to produce more heat to melt that snow around the stove." But I was wrong (again!) because every bit of heat used to melt snow was not available then for our other needs.

We tried covering the entire floor space with tarp/ reflectors / stove mats / stove bases, etc. - no snow or lake ice showing at all, no ground showing at all, and wow, it was considerably warmer in that tent! The real proof came on a cold trip (-36C/-33F) with a breeze. The 3 tents were similar, the wood was from the same woodpile, similar tent sizes, etc. But the tent with the floor covered completely (even round the back of the stove) was noticeably warmer. The radiant thermometer pointed at the stove-tops showed the other two stoves to be pumping out more heat than the stove in the warmer tent that had the floor covered.

So we upped the ante one more notch and tried a tent with the floor completely covered with 2.5cm thick closed-cell foam - even under the stove base. On that trip is was - 30C and our feet on the floor of the tent were just fine in socks! We went through noticeably less wood. To get the big pot of morning ice water boiling we had the tent door open 1/4 of the way just to keep from sweating too much :).

Lessons learned: thick foam is too bulky to take on a long haul even if it is ridiculously comfortable! But, a lightly insulated floor covering over the entire floor makes for no hassles with melt water, and a much warmer tent per armload of fire wood.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2016, 12:22:53 pm by Undersky »

Offline Bothwell Voyageur

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #17 on: November 20, 2016, 12:37:41 pm »
Maybe cover the whole floor with inflatable pads! Any idea what the R value of those foam mats would have been? I like having the floor covered but am still experimenting to find the best non-slip floor covering.
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Offline Undersky

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #18 on: November 20, 2016, 09:38:12 pm »
Hey BV, we have to set a date for you to experience the toasty-toes experience of a fully-foam-padded floor.

I don't know the R-value of the pads but I do know that the stack on the toboggan was 60cmX60cmX60cm! Light-weight, and a great place to sit on while having a break, but pretty bulky! :)

After two days the snow under the stove was dry and un-melted. Above it had been the 2.5 cm foam pad under the single stove board (just like the one at WCS). Heck, you could easily sleep right on the foam floor. You'd not need the R9 sleeping pad for warmth, just for softness :)

The dog would be in heaven - sprawled warmly on whatever part of the floor she chose.

Let's make a plan - winter has to start pretty soon!

Offline chimpac

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #19 on: November 21, 2016, 09:04:01 am »
 7" pole barn nails hold very well in ice. They are easier to get out if you give them a hit enough to break the frozen bond then pull them with a vise grip or axe. My hatchet has a nail puller slot.

Offline Forse07

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #20 on: January 04, 2017, 01:09:44 pm »
I was out last week and was able to find an area of the lake with no slush to set up camp. We packed down the snow and set the tent up on that. Good thing we did because by the time we left the slush had found us and it would have been impossible to get the tent off the ice if it wasn't raised. We did have a couple puddles form inside the tent but nothing that caused any problems. Our first experience of camping on ice went very well, thanks for all of your input.

Offline AunNordDuNord

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #21 on: January 04, 2017, 03:42:32 pm »
Maybe cover the whole floor with inflatable pads! Any idea what the R value of those foam mats would have been? I like having the floor covered but am still experimenting to find the best non-slip floor covering.

Caribou skins hair on top!! Bulky but light!!

Offline GearFreak

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2017, 09:23:14 am »
Maybe cover the whole floor with inflatable pads! Any idea what the R value of those foam mats would have been? I like having the floor covered but am still experimenting to find the best non-slip floor covering.

Caribou skins hair on top!! Bulky but light!!

I have 1 & 1/2 hides that are cured & dried but not tanned.  Picked up the little orange bottles and when the mrs is not looking will try to complete the process in the downstairs tub.  How I wish I had a insulated & heated shop! with luck will get a few more this feb.
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Offline Bioguide

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #23 on: January 05, 2017, 09:28:49 am »
Caribou skins hair on top!! Bulky but light!!

If one was to obtain hides for a hot tent bedding/floor area is Caribou the best one to use?

Offline Bothwell Voyageur

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #24 on: January 05, 2017, 10:30:20 am »
Maybe cover the whole floor with inflatable pads! Any idea what the R value of those foam mats would have been? I like having the floor covered but am still experimenting to find the best non-slip floor covering.

Caribou skins hair on top!! Bulky but light!!

I have 1 & 1/2 hides that are cured & dried but not tanned.  Picked up the little orange bottles and when the mrs is not looking will try to complete the process in the downstairs tub.  How I wish I had a insulated & heated shop! with luck will get a few more this feb.

You're gonna need a bigger toboggan or maybe you will end up sleeping in the back yard in your snowtrekker if you get caught tanning hides in the bathroom. ;)
www.canoepaddler.net for custom made gear and fireboxes

Online rbinhood

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #25 on: January 05, 2017, 01:17:20 pm »
I think you could use whitetail deer hides, tanned with the hair on. The hair is hollow, and a great insulator.
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Offline Hutchy

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #26 on: January 05, 2017, 01:26:01 pm »
While it is hollow, the hairs do not wear well. Maybe fine for a while, but long term it will likely disappoint. The hairs are fragile and will break and fall out with more regularity than, say  any of the furbearers. As a semi disposable  floor for a tent, might work for a while



However, I do happen to know of a trapper who is willing to part with a whack of beaver pelts...

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Offline kinguq

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #27 on: January 05, 2017, 04:47:48 pm »
Caribou skins are fantastic once you get used to ingesting hairs in virtually everything you eat or drink. Comfy and warm.

Kinguq.

Offline into the wind

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #28 on: January 05, 2017, 07:50:42 pm »
"Caribou skins are fantastic once you get used to ingesting hairs in virtually everything you eat or drink. Comfy and warm.

Kinguq."

Agreed! Really warm, but you find those hairs everywhere.

Offline fisherman

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Re: Winter Camping on Ice
« Reply #29 on: January 05, 2017, 10:55:43 pm »
maybe try some soft wood flooring :)
i used some of this fallen black spruce last Nov